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  buying optics
« on: November 13, 2008, 18:07:54 PM » by bergerbullets
i have to say one word on this, i met many people purchasing optics and seriously expensive ones without knowing what they are getting.  guys do your homework before purchasing and see what you are getting yourself and what for before you pay especially if you could easily get a nice trip for 3 weeks with the same cash. 

You need to know what are buying it for, discipline, size of average target that you will shoot at, precision shooting or simply for IPSC, Fixed distance shooting, Benchrest or Field Precision scopes.

If you want a Target optic dont just look atthe word target on a website or dealer and order.  Make sure you have what are known as Target Turrets, these are rezeroable after you set your rifle and you can actually "DIAL" a shot meaning you enter the Dope in the optic.  There is alot of info online, some very good forums etc and ASK before you purchase otherwise it will cost you much more in the long run.  nowadays there are no longer problems with information. 

Sometime ago i had setup an optics course to present but some came up with a load of bullocks, well im thinking of having that setup once im back home as a guide to optics purchase and i had the luck to try some of the best optics while im here.
Remember the OPTIC is the firing system just as much as the gun is, and if you're still not convinced on this one then you are still on Letter A of the alphabet.

Make sure you get Target TURRETS that are Finger adjustable, i have seen already 5 cases of people purchasing the wrong scope for what they intended and this 'wrong purchase' has cost them more than a couple hundred Euros Extra.  Don't just buy an object because its Brand A or B, look at the specs and ASK before you buy it and Ask the right crowd! Its a pity that you spend hundreds or thousands of Euros on an Optic that simply won't do what you are after, it's not that its not a good optic, its simply not for your need and sometimes a scope costing half as much would have served your purpose much better.
This is not a TARGET turret, it is not rezeroable, its to be set once and not touched, not much use to target shooters.

A TARGET optic should have turrets that look like any of these

then you have to decide if to have it in MOA or in MILS.  simple reasoning is this, If you have a mil dot reticle or a reticle based in MILS then you need MILS turret to have a perfect combination because they are the same increments.
this is a MIL turret meaning each number on this Turret represents the Equivalent in Mils on the Reticle. this is from a S&B PM2 model

here you can see a Mil reticle too.

If on the other hand you get an MOA reticle like on the NIghtforce NXS, then go for an MOA turret. here is an example of an MOA reticle made by nightforce, each line on the vertical is 1 MOA whereas on the horizontal its 2MOA.

another MOA reticle in the field

you can have a mix of MOA turret and Mil reticle but this is not the best option however make sure that the optic you buy has target turrets.  after you set you first zero, the turret will be removed and placed on the '0' marking so you can dial in your shots from there.
i hope this helps clear up the Fog abit.

oh btw the same goes for range finders, don't wave the money before you know its what you want, some are good for golfers but not for shooting and what they advertise is purely in Laboratory conditions which in reality means a good 40% lower hoever from what i have tried in the field in order of preference goes , Vectronix (made in switzerland) also supply the vector range finder, it will be the most consistant and further ranging than any other civilian model you can get. after comes Swarovski laserguide 8x30, then Leica 1200,900.  These are are investment while the others are throwing your cash away so if your are forking out the money for a 800m range finder make sure that is what you are getting and try it out before you purchase it.

Same goes for Spotting scopes, some are good to look at the moon and starts on a mid summer night but not for shooting, they are either too cumbersome, possibly overwhelmingly expensive and remember you wont be looking for bulletholes much past 300m, you will only see the trace of the bullet.  anything over 30x is not really usable in Mediterranean climate, its simply too warm and you will only see mirage, mirage and tons of it and if you want to follow trace, 25 max 30 x is the maximum although i have found 20x the best mag to watch for trace. Reticles are also available in Spotting scopes as of the last years and these allow someone to spot your shots with exact precision and give you the best correction.

« Last Edit: November 13, 2008, 18:27:00 PM by bergerbullets »

range it, dial it, squeeze the round off.
Certified Precision Rifle Handloader, Basic & Advanced- Russell Simmonds Reloading School - UK

  Re: buying optics
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2008, 14:50:47 PM » by Rifle
Seems you`re an expert in optics.

  Re: buying optics
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2008, 11:24:58 AM » by bergerbullets
i dont believe in experts but knowledgeable is a better word.  when you try different optics especially at long distances which is a possibility here, you can tell one optic from the other more reasonably.  when the targets are past 1000meters some faults come more readily visible, some reticles show their minuses more than their pluses and dialing different scopes gives you a good feeling of how some feel compared to others and im lucky enough that the members here have some of the best optics money can buy.  is it not very often that you see some equipment like Vectronix lrf's unless you are military and these are the aston martins of lrf's together with 6 different Schmidt's and 5 zeiss near each other plus some nightforce, leupolds, kahles on a firing line placed on nice Pgm's Sako's, Nemesis, Mc millans etc so its a valuable experience.

range it, dial it, squeeze the round off.
Certified Precision Rifle Handloader, Basic & Advanced- Russell Simmonds Reloading School - UK

  Re: buying optics
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2008, 17:48:34 PM » by S&W in .38
Seems you`re an expert in optics.

He knows his stuff ...

-- Mervyn Borg

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